Katy (00:00):
Let's work it. Let's work it. Hello everyone and welcome back to Work It, a Uuv career exploration podcast. My name is Katie and I'm a writer and communications professional who recently earned my MA in English from you Vic. And a fun fact about me is that when I'm at home, I drink my coffee black because I don't like to buy milk, but when I'm out I take it with milk and sugar. I'm here today with my friend and colleague Emma.

Emma (00:56):
Hello everybody. I am Emma and a recent co-op graduate. And since we're doing fun facts today, a fun fact about me is that my favorite animal is the elephant

Katy (01:07):
That's my sibling's favorite animal. Yeah, I just felt like the people need to know more than just my job. You know, I really feel like we built a connection and they need to know something about me. So that's what they can know. My coffee habits

Emma (01:18):
Brings the personal element in. I love that.

Katy (01:20):
, before we move into our conversation today, I want to take a moment to acknowledge that we are gathering and recording at the University of Victoria. I want to acknowledge with respect the Lekwungen peoples on whose traditional territory the University of Victoria stands, and the Songhees, Esquimalt and WSANEC whose historical relationships with the land continue to this day. When I first moved to Victoria, I knew very little about the history of this territory or its ecology, the life that has been growing here and living here since time Immor. And I got involved with the community garden at eVic and had just such a wonderful opportunity to build my relationship to this land through gardening and spending time outside with people who give care to the land. So I'm very grateful for that and continue to feel privileged and honored to live, work, and play here.

Katy (02:13):
Today we're diving back into our Ask an Expert series where we're talking about your biggest career and work related questions, even the ones you might be scared to ask. We are really excited to be talking to Darcy Gabri today. Darcy is a career educator, writer and spiritual seeker. She grew up constantly asking, what should I do with my life? And decided to turn that into a career. She's been a career counselor and a life coach for over 20 years and in her spare time she loves to dabble in creative pursuits like writing, collage work, art journaling, and she's obsessed with reading tarot cards. We are so excited to have Darcy here today to talk about how can we practice self-care and avoid burning out at work. Darcy, we're so grateful to have you here to tackle this. Welcome.

Darcie (03:01):
Well thank you very much. I'm super excited to be here, chat with you today.

Emma (03:05):
Let's dive into our first question for you, Darcy, starting with what is burnout and how do we recognize the signs?

Darcie (03:14):
Absolutely. So burnout really is a big topic, right? And something prone to, I think many of us, there's a few signs that you can really look at. Starting with that sense of feeling Overwhelmed is a huge one, right? That growing stress that people tend to feel, especially maybe if you're new on the job or if you've got other things kind of going on in the background, you know, trying to balance everything. Burnout can look like feeling disconnected at work as well. You know, maybe you, you're getting tired of your job or maybe you're just moody and kind of wanna rip everybody's head off, right? That can also be a sign that you know, you're getting a little bit, uh, stressed and overwhelmed and maybe just, you know, not being satisfied with your job or maybe you can't feel productive. So it can look like quite a few different things, lots of different signs to look for.

Katy (03:58):
That's a great answer. And I think so many important ways that we can recognize when we might not be feeling good at work, when our health might not be in the best place it could be in the workplace. I'm wondering if you were talking to a person who's never heard of burnout, never heard that word before. Could you define it in like one sentence?

Darcie (04:18):
For sure. Burnout is to me just a sense of physical, mental and maybe emotional exhaustion where you just feel like you maybe just can't go on. You can't deal with a day-to-day. You're just tired of work and just can't seem to keep going.

Emma (04:34):
Have you ever experienced burnout in a job yourself?

Darcie (04:38):
Oh, I absolutely have. And I can attest to that. It is absolutely no fun. However, it does happen I think to a lot of people. For me it's happened when I feel like there's just too much going on. If I've been asked to do too many responsibilities, if I don't feel like I'm getting the help that I need at work or maybe I'm feeling unappreciated. And then for me what that grew into is I did have a really hard time like just dragging myself off to work each day. It became more and more of a struggle because I didn't wanna be there and I just felt exhausted mentally, physically and spiritually and just kind of emotionally drained. And so, yeah, unfortunately that has happened to me.

Emma (05:16):
I'm sorry to hear that. It's sad for anyone who has to experience this.

Katy (05:20):
Absolutely. But I wanna thank you for sharing that because I think that this is a lot more common than some people might think when they're going through that process and feeling overwhelmed and exhausted at work. Um, they might think that they're the only one or that they know a lot of people who love their jobs or maybe, you know, this is their dream job. It's the field they always wanted to work in. So why are they feeling this way? It's so important to talk about these feelings openly because they're normal. It's not your fault. A lot of people go through it. So we've talked about some of the signs of burnout and a lot of those are sort of internal, like how are you feeling in your day-to-day, your emotional, physical and mental state. Could you elaborate a little bit more on that question? What does burnout feel like when you're experiencing that?

Darcie (06:08):
I like to distinguish it by both physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual. So just to be clear, so there can really be like physical symptoms. So that sense of really being tired, exhausted, just like complete lack of energy. It can also be like a mental exhaustion, right? Where you just feel dull or really flat, maybe a little bit overwhelmed. It can be where you're even maybe feeling hard on yourself and hard on other people. It can be the emotional that crankiness moodiness the increasingly critical of both yourself and others. And it can have a spiritual component as well too, where it's just really feeling that kind of loss of purpose. Asking yourself maybe like, you know, what am I doing here and what am I doing in my life? So it can have quite a wide range.

Katy (06:51):
Totally. It's like that phase when you get emails and you're like, don't ask me for, do not email me. Do not contact me, don't ask me for leave me alone. You're saying that could be a red flag, ,

Darcie (07:04):
It could be a bit of a red flag. Absolutely. Yeah. One more email and I'm gonna go postal. That's right.

Katy (07:08):
Like, I'm gonna snap. Um, for real.

Emma (07:12):
So now that we've identified what burnout feels like, what burnout could look like, the next step is what do we do about it? And that's a really broad question. So to maybe narrow it down a little bit, let's talk about boundaries at work and maybe how to ask for help

Darcie (07:30):
For sure. So I think one of the first places to start is to know that you actually have the right to speak up and to say that you know, you're feeling overwhelmed or that you need help, one of the key things in terms of setting those boundaries is recognizing for yourself that it's not a sign of weakness. It really is a sign of strength, right? Because a lot of people even struggle with that or especially new employees can figure, I don't have the right to complain, I should just keep quiet. But you absolutely a hundred percent have the right. Um, then from there, in terms of who and how you might set those boundaries, I'd recommend maybe finding somebody at work that you really trust to talk to, first of all, just to get that sense of how that particular workplace works. Um, ask to maybe speak to them in private and then kind of go from there. 'cause they can be a good source of advice to you as well. It can also help if you're not feeling quite ready to speak directly to your employers, maybe find a trusted coworker, somebody you can connect with first.

Emma (08:27):
That's a great idea. To take it a step further, let's say that you recognize you're burnt out and you've talked to somebody and you think, okay, I'm ready to go to my supervisor or the head of my organization to bring up how I'm feeling. Do you have an example of what you might say to your supervisor?

Darcie (08:50):
Absolutely. It's a great question. And so I, I would maybe adopt a couple of different approaches. One might be to negotiate and so maybe if you're being asked to do additional duties and that's what's making you feel overwhelmed, you could maybe come back and say, um, okay, I've been asked to do this extra duty or responsibility. I can maybe do this but then I can't maybe do that. And so that act of kind of negotiation can both be that chance to say I can't do everything but I can do at least this. So it can maybe reshuffle your duties if that would help you feel less overwhelmed or help to set some boundaries. And then I think a second way I'd go is just learning to say no. That's often one of the hardest things that a lot of people struggle with in the workplace, particularly 'cause they think they don't have the right to say no. It's like whatever the boss says is rules as much as they choose to pile on, I just have to say yes. But you actually do have a right to say no if it's unreasonable. And so having the confidence to do that is a skill that can be learned as well.

Katy (09:48):
I love that advice and I think it is especially important for people who come from historically marginalized groups in the workplace to really internalize it. You may be used to feeling like you need to work 10 times harder and do 10 times more than anyone else, but your wellbeing is still important. And just like anyone else, you have the right to say no. It can become so ingrained in us, I think whether it's women or folks or racialized people, to feel like we always have to say yes, yes, yes and prove ourselves. But we can say no, we can draw a line.

Darcie (10:31):
We absolutely can draw a line. And the one thing I will say too, I was fortunate in that, well I don't know if my, my father might agree, but I was fortunate I learned to say no from an early age . And however I know it is harder for some people, right? And and feeling the confidence and the comfort level in in just starting to believe I have that right to question at work or to to just say no.

Katy (10:51):
Totally. And maybe even like practice that outside of work like if you have a friend or partner, you can ask them to practice with you. I find that the more that you do it, the easier it gets. When I first started at my job, anytime I didn't have the capacity to take something on, I felt anxious about it and kind of guilty. But the more I practiced saying no or even not right now, it gets easier and easier every single time.

Darcie (11:18):
Yeah, I love that. And the, and the not right now can also be a great alternative. And I do love the idea of practicing with friends first because yeah, even they might be asking us to do many things that we just simply don't have the capacity for at that moment. Practice is awesome.

Katy (11:33):
So often, at least in my experience and from what I've heard from my friends and my peers is that one of the things that can really contribute to burnout is being in a work culture that you do not gel with or a work culture that isn't considerate of the holistic wellbeing of the people in that environment. I'm wondering if you have any techniques or questions that people can ask during the job application and job search process to try to understand what an organization's culture is around work-life balance, self-care setting boundaries and you know, prioritizing long-term wellbeing.

Darcie (12:13):
I'd like to suggest that there are a couple different approaches depending on your comfort level, right? Some people prefer just direct communication. So just asking things during an interview, like what are the expectations around deadlines, timelines, that kind of stuff. 'cause chances are that kind of conversation if meeting type deadlines is gonna be part of your job, gen Z are, it's come up during the interview. But if it hasn't, um, just asking direct questions like that can really be helpful. A more kind of indirect approach for some of those who might find that a bit too confrontational. Things like asking how do the team support each other. If I needed help, who would I ask? Even more indirect questions could be asking how long people typically stay with a company can also kind of tell you a little bit more about how flexible they are, how, how happy people are. 'cause often if you have a great employer, long-term, um, employees will be quite prevalent if there's a higher turnaround. That too can be. Yeah. One more indirect kind of way of finding out.

Emma (13:10):
That's a really good point. Especially with the way that work has changed over the last couple of years. We Don't always go to our workplace anymore. Sometimes we do a lot of our work from home. How can we practice self-care when we're at home?

Darcie (13:26):
If you're working from home, I think having a designated workspace is number one place to start setting boundaries with, you know, whether it's your roommates, your family, if you have kids, making sure that you have that private space. 'cause it really starts there. Being clear with everybody that you are working right now can be a great act of self-care. 'cause then, you know, reduces the stress and likelihood of interruptions. I would say taking care of yourself while you're at home just like you would in the workplace get up regular stretch breaks, you know, maybe go grab a cup of tea or some other uh, favorite goodie. Um, leaving work on time can actually be another key one too 'cause that temptation can be there. Oh, my computer or my laptop is quite handy. Or maybe I'll just check a couple emails on my phone. Please don't. Right. Honestly, self-care is knowing again those boundaries. Like we had talked about saying, you know, when the workday is done, put it aside whether you physically close your computer or walk away from your desk, shut the door, whatever the case may be, those can be some really great starting points for taking care of yourself at home.

Katy (14:30):
I think that's all such great advice. And I even would add like so many young professionals don't necessarily have enough space where we have an at-home office or a totally private workspace, but you can really still have one specific location in your space that is your work location. I live in the tiniest little postage stamp apartment with a roommate and I'll be honest, sometimes it is difficult but I have this kind of rule with myself where work doesn't happen in my bedroom. It can happen anywhere else in the house, but my bedroom is not a space where work happens or things like oh this is the seat in the dining room table that I always sit at to take meetings. Like there's definitely ways to adapt the smallest little spaces or the most crowded living situations to still have those boundaries.

Darcie (15:26):
Yeah, and thank you for mentioning that. 'cause speaking as someone who lives in a shoebox as well, I am very lucky in that I don't have roommates, but it is like the designated space absolutely lifesaver, right?

Katy (15:36):
Yeah. You're living my dream

Darcie (15:38):
For the shoebox or for the lack of roommates, just questions.

Katy (15:40):
The lack of roommates . Yeah, I love my roommate but um, sometimes I just would also love to not have one

Emma (15:47):
That is fair. I also wanted to loop back to that being done at the end of your day and not going over that. That's a really big boundary that I think a lot of us, especially people who are new to a role, they think, oh if I just do that little bit extra, if I just push a little harder, put in a little extra time, people are gonna notice and people are gonna help me move up. And occasionally sure that might happen. But what I've noticed is that that sets an expectation that then they can give you more to do because they say, oh well you're accomplishing this much in this allotted time. Here's some more. And then you're not accomplishing what you think you're accomplishing

Darcie (16:27):
A Absolutely. And can I just say as well, I don't know if you are familiar with the golden handcuffs kind of an expression, but that is something like I've worked in a nonprofit for a really long time as well and even though I love the companies I was working for, it can become that thing, right? Because I always say we teach people how to treat us and it can be exactly that. I'll go a little bit extra, I'll work a little bit longer, becomes that expectation of well you'll just go a little bit, work a little bit extra. So great point to be watching out for. Thank you. Yeah,

Emma (16:56):
Absolutely.

Katy (16:56):
And with that point about the nonprofit workspace Darcie, I think that's so key. So many of us are lucky to work in a job or an organization that we feel a real connection to or feel passionate about that field or that company. And it can be hard sometimes to set those boundaries when you're emotionally invested in your work. But I think it's important to remember that if you aren't feeling like I can do these self-care tasks for me, you can always feel like I can do these self-care tasks for others and for the organization because you setting consistent boundaries to take care of yourself is always gonna be better for others than you like crashing and burning and totally needing to disengage.

Darcie (17:41):
Fantastic point because yeah, if when we do crash and burn then yeah. Like our coworkers have to cover for us doesn't help for anybody.

Katy (17:47):
Absolutely. We've talked a little bit about self-care when working from home, which is so, so important More and more a lot of us are working in hybrid situations or slowly returning to the office or some of us may not work the types of positions where we are able to work remotely when we are on site at work. Are there any specific strategies or tools that you could suggest for managing self-care in our day-to-day when we are at the office at the workplace?

Darcie (18:18):
Yeah, absolutely. Some of the same rules apply of course, you know, make sure you take your regular stretch breaks and water breaks, tea breaks, all that kind of stuff. But there's also a couple extra things if you're on the workplace. One of the number ones is uh, be friendly. But in terms of being mindful as well in setting boundaries, many of us are fortunate enough to love the people we work with, but there can be some real chatty Kathys where time goes by. It's not just team meetings, but it's like those little sort of informal conversations to be mindful of, you know, the difference between establishing good relationships and spending half our day chatting. And also again like things like avoiding office gossip because oftentimes those chatty Cathys can lead to, you know, what are you doing but gossiping, right? And so those both can be time wasters and also really kind of energy busters as well too. So I'd say watching out for those kinds of things, but also setting the clear boundaries too. Like thanks, it's been awesome chatting with you gotta get back to work.

Katy (19:10):
Personal experience. My office at work doesn't have a window in it and that can really honestly over the course of a day or a week have a pretty like serious impact on my mood and the way I'm feeling about what I'm doing. And so pretty early on in working where I work now, I kind of made this rule for myself that I need to leave the office at least once a day no matter how busy I am, no matter how much is going on, no matter the weather. I have to like step out of the office space and go to a secondary location for some amount of time. And it has honestly like worked wonders on my mental health at work.

Darcie (19:49):
Totally. And can I just say as a basement dweller at work for many, many years, you know again the nonprofit, right? Absolutely. Get outside. You know, even if it's raining the fresh air and just the break from that windowless environment can just do wonders for your head space. You know, you'll be more productive, you'll wake up, but you'll just feel better overall. Right? And please, please, please, number one, don't eat lunch at your desk. I wanna throw that one in. Yeah. And so I, I actually use the the habit of I never bring lunch to work 'cause then it forces me to get out at lunchtime to go forage for food. Yeah. So that can be another one.

Katy (20:21):
Oh, I really like that tip. And it's one that I don't currently do, but I am just like duly noted .

Darcie (20:29):
Yeah. And it doesn't have to be an expensive lunch for those of us who are mindful of cost and health and all that kind of stuff as well. Even if you go eat your lunch outside or elsewhere or something. But

Emma (20:37):
Yeah, I'm a big fan of grabbing my coworker Katy to go grab a coffee once a day if I can manage it because it's the best part of my day. .

Darcie (20:48):
It's right, like just the mental break and, and also, you know, well okay as a coffee addict as well.

Katy (20:53):
Yeah. Truly. So yeah,

Emma (20:55):
Big time. Need that latte.

Katy (20:57):
. Yeah. It's better for me and also better for everyone I work with if I have a cup of coffee during my day.

Darcie (21:02):
Oh and, and I'm sure you guys know the expression of the hangry, you know.

Emma (21:05):
Oh yeah.

New Speaker (21:06):
Oftentimes if I find like by late morning and I'm getting, you know, kind of I'm getting a bit, it might not be overwhelmed but I'm just, you know what I'm trying to say here. And um, it's really just need for either food or perhaps another dose of coffee.

Emma (21:17):
Yeah. It's great if you can recognize that in yourself. Right?

Darcie (21:20):
I like to use the expression for the safety of everyone.

Katy (21:23):
Yes. . Yeah . I think that's so important because as crucial as it is to be able to recognize when we are burned out and how do we deal with that when we reach that point. It's also so important to be able to do some of that preventative care. And when we kind of build these habits of self-care work-life balance and setting healthy boundaries, we hopefully can avoid ever getting to that crisis point.

Emma (21:51):
Yeah, that's a really good point. So let's say that you love your job, you're passionate about it and you want to do well and you want to be a good part of that office culture. How can you do that while still taking these preventative measures? What are some tips or ideas that you might have to prevent yourself from getting to the point of burnout?

Darcie (22:16):
Sure. That's a great question too. And I'd like to circle back to something we mentioned before about I think we can actually make our best contribution by really looking after ourselves as a starting point.

Katy (22:26):
Mm-Hmm .

Darcie (22:26):
And so I think how we talk to ourselves moving into that situation is an essential starting point, right? And so the idea of I'm here to do my job but I'm also here to do my best. How I can do my best is to be at my best by looking after myself. So things like the positive self-talk is, is really important. I'm not just talking about, you know, your little affirmations, oh I got this kind of thing. But just how you know, are you being kind to yourself? Are you being realistic with yourself? Are you setting reasonable expectations for yourself? It's really important, you know, we all want that positive regard from other people, but we also have to tune in with ourselves. Does this job feel good for me? What am I getting out of it? Because that can be a great method of self-care as well. Setting those boundaries like we talked about really being clear in our communications. If I am starting to feel stressed like we talked about before, it kind of escalates and gets outta hand. Am I ready to ask for help? Am I ready to communicate with my team? You know, I'm having a really hard day or you know, I just need extra bit of time or you know, I just can't take this on today. Those kinds of skills, communication with ourself and others. It's a great starting point.

Katy (23:35):
I love that. And I'm thinking about how for a lot of us, the extent to which we can practice. Some of this is dependent kind of like we were talking about on workplace culture and for people who are experiencing burnout, sometimes it's in spite of a supportive workplace culture and sometimes it's because of a workplace culture. Do you have any tips or strategies for people navigating that about recognizing when it's time to look for a different opportunity?

Darcie (24:07):
Absolutely, and I, I think it's a fantastic question because it doesn't, you know, every situation is not gonna work out. If it comes to the point where it's more defeating, there's more negative than good, it's okay to say it like it. It doesn't mean it's a personal failure that you can't make this job work. It's just no longer a fit for you. If you can't get that support. It can be a time to just start rethinking. Before you're ready to go. I would say do make sure you've tried to talk to your manager. Maybe ask them if they have employee assistance kind of programs that can sometimes provide some kind of counseling too. If you think it's moving that way where you just need some additional supports. If however you have made the decision or you're seriously thinking that it is time to leave, that might be a great time to maybe talk to a career counselor and maybe talk to your family friends, get well maybe talk to the career counselor first. Your family and friends might have different opinions. Um, but maybe talk to an objective person who can help you talk your ideas out. 'cause that can often help you clarify. Do you need to just deal with the situation at hand or is it really time to move on? If you have made that decision, it's time to move on. Notice that it's okay. Leaving can be hard sometimes, right? Because we, we can take that baggage with us. However, the quicker we can let go of some of that baggage, just say, I've learned what I can from this position. I'm now ready to move on. The mindset that we have when we walk away from a job, is it ultimately a learning opportunity for us and I'm ready to move on, can help us make a cleaner break. Did any of that make sense?

Katy (25:37):
Absolutely. It made perfect sense. I think it was so helpful. Someone that I know like recently was leaving a toxic job situation and really, really struggled with it because they said to me like, I don't want to fail at this. I have taken it on and I don't want to be the kind of person that quits. And I totally understand that feeling as a perfectionist and a type A person. But as much as work takes up a lot of our day and our skills and can become a really big part of our identity, it's not who we are. And needing to leave a situation or even making a mistake at work, it doesn't mean you have failed or that like you are a failure. I think that that kind of comes back to some of the positive self-talk you were mentioning, being able to sort of decouple our self-worth from a situation that's happening in the workplace.

Darcie (26:31):
It, it absolutely is. And I've seen that situation too many times. And I'll have to say like it's been a learning thing for me as well too over the years. It has become easier for me to separate from that what has become a toxic or unhealthy workplace for me and to walk away from in a smoother way. It doesn't mean I failed, it means as, as long as I can walk away saying I feel I've done my best, I can walk away in peace. No looking back and not regrets.

Katy (26:55):
I love that. Yeah, me too. That's definitely inspiring. And some of the questions that I might ask myself if I was considering moving on would be, am I passionate about the work that I'm doing or the company that I'm working for? Is it the tasks that I'm doing at my job that I dislike? Is there something else I'd rather be doing? Are there any other things that you might ask yourself if you're trying to decide, is this burnout or am I just done with this role?

Darcie (27:26):
You've identified sort of the key ones. Try to get specific about what it is about that job. 'cause yeah, if it is something simple, just like the tasks you visit, your values, what is most important to you in the workplace, right? Because you probably picked that first job or the current job for a reason, right? If it was just money, you can make money at any jobs, right? If it's making that contribution and you wanna use a certain set of skills or maybe a a cause that you believe in, those can all be things that can lead you in a new direction. And also just realize that as we grow, we change our interests, change our values might change. So it's always great to do a periodic reassessment of you know, your interests, your values, um, really what you're here to do. And even, you know, as your life changes, maybe before you had kids, your life is different right? When you're a recent graduate or maybe if you're looking for work while you're still in school. All I'm trying to say is look at where you are right now and then just revisit some of those things and know that it's okay.

Katy (28:22):
I love that. And it's such an important skill to be able to cultivate that. Checking in with yourself and acknowledging that change is normal and it's good and we're all gonna go through it. We've talked a lot about taking care of ourselves at work and as somebody who's been through this process yourself, I would love to know what sustainable success professionally means to you and if you have any advice for students or new grads setting themselves up for sustainable success in the workplace.

Darcie (28:56):
For me personally, sustainable success means am I happy. I try and stay present. I don't worry too much about the future, but if I can say like, I like going to work, I like the people that I'm working with, I do feel like I'm doing what I'm here to do. I'm using my skills, I'm, you know, enjoying the, the work that I'm doing. Those are a great starting point because the more you can stay present and keep checking in with yourself to make sure that it is still a fit with you, I think that is one of the keys that we'll build into sustainable success. Right? And it's not about, okay, today I have a bad day so I'm tossing the whole thing. It's keeping a bigger perspective, right? But I mean if you can do that on a fairly consistent basis, always checking in with yourself and making sure you know this job or this, it fits in with what I need for right now, you'll be on the right path to sustainable success.

Katy (29:45):
And I think it also really makes a space for and acknowledges that a lot of us, whether temporarily or for a longer period will probably have to work a job that we don't connect to, that we don't feel as fulfilling, fulfill. But it's so important to have connection and fulfillment somewhere. And so if you're in that situation where you are working a job 'cause you just have to make the rent or you just have to pay for tuition, does that allow you space to have your connection, your values, your fulfillment elsewhere in your life?

Darcie (30:19):
Can I just say thank you for mentioning that too because that really does come back to the heart of work-life balance, right? There have been times in my own life where I had more time and energy and desire to put into the workplace, right? Maybe if I'm building my career, you know, that was more important. But you always, and for me personally as well, I needed my time to have my, my fun things. You know, reading tarot cards. If I didn't have time for that, you know, I would feel sad or I'd love to study things that are of interest to me, whatever it is. Like whether you want time for family, friends, personal interest, just looking after yourself, traveling, having, you know, vacation free time to veg on the couch if that's what you really need, right? All of that is what leads to an ultimately balanced life. And just be mindful balance might mean different things to different people as well.

Emma (31:04):
That's great advice. Thank you for sharing that with us.

Katy (31:07):
I'd love To ask you if there's any Workshops Or programs or resources or events that Are coming out of UVIC that could help students with all that we've chatted about today. Or even if it's not a UVIC resource, if you have like a book that you love or a podcast, just plug anything that will bring you joy to plug .

Darcie (31:26):
Okay, sure. Um, I will of course start with uh, career services at UVic. Whether you're a current student or an alum, you can always uh, book an appointment with one of the career educators to chat with them about whether, you know, you just need help with how to brainstorm a situation in the workplace or if you are thinking about that career change. For those who are thinking about the career change, we do have a career clarity program which guides you through your interest, values, et cetera. If you are feeling like you need a little bit more help, um, in terms of some counseling, somebody to talk to, I'd maybe encourage you to think about visiting the student wellness center. 'cause you can chat there with certified health professionals as well in a variety of fields. There's counselors, they have some group workshops as well. If you're feeling kind of more of a spiritual sort of a need, I would encourage, maybe check out the multi-faith center. They offer some really, uh, great activities as well. Have to say. I've been to, uh, a related workshop there on drumming. It was awesome. Had a great, great deal of fun. Um, pounding out the drums was uh, making music and getting out a little, you know, exercise as well.

Katy (32:27):
That creative impulse.

Darcie (32:30):
Absolutely all that stuff. I will go back to many employers. They do have employee assistance programs, so that can also be a resource. But really most important I think of all staying connected with family, friends, whatever kind of peer support group we can find, I think is absolutely one of the most essential methods that we can have to look after ourselves and remember, no person is an island and I would encourage, you know, stay connected 'cause it's what life's all about. Right?

Emma (32:57):
Absolutely. That's great. And we will link all of those resources in the description so you can check all of those out in your own time.

Katy (33:07):
I think that is such a great note to end on. Yeah, we're all just looking for connection and there's a lot of places we can cultivate it. Darcy,

Emma (33:15):
Thanks for being here. Before we let you go, is there anything else that you'd like to share with our listeners about this topic?

Darcie (33:22):
Well, I just wanna thank you guys for having me. But really I think the number one thing I'd like you to take away from here is just know that every day you're just doing your best for whatever reason you're going to work. Whether it is just to pay the rent, whether it is to gain satisfaction, just know that you're always be kind to yourself as you're doing that. 'cause the better you take care of yourself, the more, um, grounded you can stay, the healthier you'll be. And just the overall happier you'll be, the better contribution you'll make to, to yourself, to your family, to everybody. So look after yourself. I think it's truly important.

Katy (33:55):
Mic drop. Yeah.

Emma (33:56):
Thank you so, so much. Yeah, thank you very much for being here and sharing your wisdom with us today. I

Katy (34:02):
Think this was an awesome and really kind of like inspiring, fabulous conversation. So yeah, I just wanna reiterate like thank you so much Darcy, for sharing your time and your expertise with me and Emma and with the future people who will listen to this. We really, really appreciate it. workit is developed and distributed by co-op and career services at the University of Victoria. The podcast is hosted by Katy DeCoste and Emma Ulveland, and produced by Katy, Emma and Joy Poliquin. Today's guest was Darcie Gabruck. Our theme music and art were created by Emma Ulveland with audio editing by Emma Ulveland. If you enjoyed today's episode, subscribe and you'll never miss an update. To learn more about career possibilities and resources from UVic, visit vic.ca.